WEBVTT 00:00:02.280 --> 00:00:04.640 Well, then 00:00:04.640 --> 00:00:08.640 I think we're already live 00:00:08.640 --> 00:00:12.640 too, so we can adjust to the 00:00:12.640 --> 00:00:16.760 timings and the program. 00:00:16.760 --> 00:00:20.760 We can begin with the inauguration of these 00:00:20.760 --> 00:00:24.760 third International Days of Historical 00:00:24.760 --> 00:00:27.920 Novel between archive and fiction. 00:00:28.000 --> 00:00:32.000 This is the third edition of the Meeting 00:00:32.000 --> 00:00:36.080 and, of course, we are grateful. 00:00:37.440 --> 00:00:41.440 It is only right to thank both the attendees 00:00:41.440 --> 00:00:45.440 and all the speakers and participants who 00:00:45.440 --> 00:00:49.440 have joined this initiative and, of course, 00:00:49.440 --> 00:00:53.440 the Rey Juan Carlos University, which 00:00:53.440 --> 00:00:57.440 sponsored the meeting, provided us with the 00:00:57.440 --> 00:01:01.440 facilities, and has been actively collaborating 00:01:01.440 --> 00:01:05.440 with this type of initiative, which I will 00:01:05.440 --> 00:01:09.440 comment on later. And I think I must first 00:01:09.440 --> 00:01:13.440 reflect on this fantastic lineup we have, 00:01:13.440 --> 00:01:17.440 because comparing it with the previous ones, 00:01:17.440 --> 00:01:21.120 with the other two editions, you can see 00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:24.120 a real talent pool of artists. 00:01:24.120 --> 00:01:28.120 So let's also give thanks to our dear Azucena, who has 00:01:28.120 --> 00:01:32.120 been the mastermind behind such a wonderful poster, 00:01:32.120 --> 00:01:36.120 Carmen, and we continue to maintain the initial objective 00:01:36.120 --> 00:01:40.120 that gave rise to this event, namely to offer researchers 00:01:40.120 --> 00:01:44.120 and the general public an interdisciplinary platform 00:01:44.120 --> 00:01:48.120 in which to return to the study of historical, romantic 00:01:48.120 --> 00:01:52.120 narrative and its classics, without ruling out new 00:01:52.120 --> 00:01:56.120 contributions from the disciplines that make up the 00:01:56.120 --> 00:02:00.120 well-known binomial that characterizes the historical 00:02:00.120 --> 00:02:04.160 novel: literature and documentary archive. 00:02:04.160 --> 00:02:08.160 In other words, it is a meeting that has been 00:02:08.160 --> 00:02:12.160 bringing together for three editions, for 00:02:12.160 --> 00:02:16.160 three years, historians, philologists, 00:02:16.160 --> 00:02:20.160 and scholars of literature, to turn their 00:02:20.160 --> 00:02:24.160 gaze towards the historical novel, 00:02:24.160 --> 00:02:28.160 fundamentally of medieval scope, due to the 00:02:28.160 --> 00:02:32.160 dynamics and studies of the different groups 00:02:32.160 --> 00:02:36.160 that organize the meeting, but also of other 00:02:36.160 --> 00:02:40.160 periods, in other, in other modalities, 00:02:40.160 --> 00:02:44.160 because we have broadened objectives and horizons. 00:02:44.560 --> 00:02:48.560 The aim is, in a way, to recover a literary tradition 00:02:48.560 --> 00:02:52.560 largely overshadowed by the later realist tradition, 00:02:52.560 --> 00:02:56.560 but which, we believe, is still relevant and essential 00:02:56.560 --> 00:03:00.560 to understanding the emergence of historical and medieval 00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:05.240 narratives in our literature, both classical and contemporary. 00:03:05.600 --> 00:03:09.600 It is certainly curious that in the 19th century, when 00:03:09.600 --> 00:03:13.600 the historical novel was established as a modern 00:03:13.600 --> 00:03:17.600 genre, Manzoni, despite contributing to the genre 00:03:17.600 --> 00:03:21.600 with at least one of the most outstanding novels, ended 00:03:21.600 --> 00:03:25.600 up pointing out the impossibility of the historical 00:03:25.600 --> 00:03:29.600 novel since it could be neither history nor literature 00:03:29.600 --> 00:03:32.640 and therefore was destined to perish. 00:03:32.640 --> 00:03:37.320 Did the Italian author not say that this was his thesis? 00:03:37.320 --> 00:03:41.280 He intended to demonstrate, and believed he had demonstrated, that the 00:03:41.280 --> 00:03:44.280 historical novel is a work in which the necessary is impossible. 00:03:44.600 --> 00:03:48.600 A work in which two essential conditions cannot be reconciled cannot 00:03:48.600 --> 00:03:52.600 even fulfill one, making a confusion contrary to the form inevitable; 00:03:52.600 --> 00:03:56.600 a work in which history and fable must intervene, without it being 00:03:56.600 --> 00:04:00.600 possible to establish or indicate in what proportion or relationship 00:04:00.600 --> 00:04:04.600 in the end, a work that cannot be composed in an adequate way because 00:04:04.600 --> 00:04:08.600 its subject is intrinsically contradictory to the vision of the fact 00:04:08.600 --> 00:04:12.600 that the Italian made a deep impression on critics as lucid as Amadeo 00:04:12.600 --> 00:04:16.520 Alonso, who at the beginning of the 20th century emphasized the 00:04:16.520 --> 00:04:19.520 unviability of the historical novel in the conflict. 00:04:19.880 --> 00:04:20.520 History. 00:04:20.520 --> 00:04:24.440 Poetry is where his own exhaustion resides. 00:04:24.800 --> 00:04:28.800 The novel cannot aspire to the rigor of history while 00:04:28.800 --> 00:04:32.160 history also aspires to become a subject of 00:04:32.160 --> 00:04:35.160 fiction; this poses an obstacle to true poetry. 00:04:35.560 --> 00:04:39.560 However, I believe that this possibilist thesis is conditioned 00:04:39.560 --> 00:04:43.560 by the high concept that both Manzoni and Alonso had of the literary 00:04:43.560 --> 00:04:48.800 work and the functions they attributed to artistic composition or historical study. 00:04:48.800 --> 00:04:52.800 Currently, the historical novel has embarked on new paths of 00:04:52.800 --> 00:04:56.440 undeniable artistic content based on the rethinking of 00:04:56.440 --> 00:04:59.440 the relationship between history and literature. 00:04:59.600 --> 00:05:02.920 But it also occupies a place in the leisure entertainment market, 00:05:02.920 --> 00:05:05.920 perhaps less elevated, but equally necessary and respectable. 00:05:05.960 --> 00:05:09.640 Soldevila had already warned that the success of the historical 00:05:09.640 --> 00:05:12.640 novel is a cyclical phenomenon, but also a necessary one. 00:05:12.880 --> 00:05:16.400 The historical novel of the genre that can save the 00:05:16.400 --> 00:05:19.400 novel by making it return to its origins. 00:05:19.480 --> 00:05:23.480 Histories, however, continue to preempt some 00:05:23.480 --> 00:05:27.480 considerations regarding the historical 00:05:27.480 --> 00:05:31.480 novel, considering it so often a minor genre, 00:05:31.480 --> 00:05:36.280 a secondary genre, even sometimes for literature. 00:05:37.080 --> 00:05:41.320 I remember, for example, you will know these. 00:05:41.320 --> 00:05:45.320 The recent controversy and spat 00:05:45.320 --> 00:05:49.320 between academic Arturo Pérez 00:05:49.320 --> 00:05:53.320 Reverte and writer David Uclés, and 00:05:53.320 --> 00:05:57.320 in some statements by the former, 00:05:57.320 --> 00:06:01.320 Pérez-Reverte said before the 00:06:01.320 --> 00:06:05.320 controversy arose that he praised 00:06:05.320 --> 00:06:08.960 the novel and the production of David Uclés. 00:06:09.200 --> 00:06:13.200 And yet, those statements are still curious or 00:06:13.200 --> 00:06:17.200 striking, precisely because he was talking about 00:06:17.200 --> 00:06:21.200 how they have it there on the slide, that it is 00:06:21.200 --> 00:06:25.480 literature, not a historical novel, it is literature. 00:06:25.480 --> 00:06:29.480 That is to say, it is implicitly granting the 00:06:29.480 --> 00:06:33.480 novel, the historical novel, a position 00:06:33.480 --> 00:06:38.320 subordinate to that of literature itself, as if they were 00:06:39.320 --> 00:06:41.360 two things 00:06:41.360 --> 00:06:42.200 different. 00:06:42.200 --> 00:06:45.320 Or, as is the nature of the historical novel itself, it could not be considered 00:06:45.320 --> 00:06:46.920 high literature. 00:06:48.040 --> 00:06:52.040 That one is especially curious, because Pérez Reverte has 00:06:52.040 --> 00:06:56.040 precisely written historical novels, novels about 00:06:56.040 --> 00:06:59.080 history, novels of a historical declaration. 00:06:59.760 --> 00:07:03.760 And well, perhaps a greater defense of the genre 00:07:03.760 --> 00:07:09.440 would be fitting from an author who has cultivated it so much. 00:07:09.800 --> 00:07:11.360 In the end, 00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:15.360 This year, as a result of national and international research 00:07:15.360 --> 00:07:19.360 networks, it has been decided to broaden the scope of the objectives 00:07:19.360 --> 00:07:24.200 we have proposed for the first and second editions with thematic proposals. 00:07:24.200 --> 00:07:28.120 For example, we have always wanted the previous editions. 00:07:28.120 --> 00:07:32.120 Also, that these meetings would serve as a tribute that 00:07:32.120 --> 00:07:37.040 would allow us to rescue, to recover some, some historical events. 00:07:37.440 --> 00:07:41.440 This year, for example, they could have served as a tribute 00:07:41.440 --> 00:07:45.360 to Urraca the First of Castile, since 2026 marks the 9th centenary of her 00:07:45.360 --> 00:07:47.320 death. 00:07:47.600 --> 00:07:51.600 We also intend to address new formats, expanding the corpus of study, which 00:07:51.600 --> 00:07:55.600 is no longer limited solely to the subgenre of the historical novel, but 00:07:55.600 --> 00:07:59.440 also to the particularities, the particularities of narrative and 00:07:59.440 --> 00:08:01.400 nineteenth-century historiography. 00:08:02.080 --> 00:08:06.080 Similarly, the organization has relied on the collaboration of the 00:08:06.080 --> 00:08:10.080 University of Santiago de Compostela and the University of Rennes, 00:08:10.080 --> 00:08:13.440 in an effort of cooperation and collaboration between 00:08:13.440 --> 00:08:15.120 internationalization and. 00:08:15.320 --> 00:08:19.320 I also think it is worth noting that this meeting is 00:08:19.320 --> 00:08:23.320 part of a series of actions undertaken by various 00:08:23.320 --> 00:08:27.320 professors at the Rey Juan Carlos University, which 00:08:27.320 --> 00:08:31.320 has consolidated neo-medieval medievalism as one 00:08:31.320 --> 00:08:37.240 of the pioneering lines of research in our country over the last few years. 00:08:37.240 --> 00:08:41.840 I think there's a significant gap so far. 00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:45.840 Today, for example, you can see on the screen that a few years 00:08:45.840 --> 00:08:49.040 ago we celebrated the 50th anniversary of the famous 00:08:49.040 --> 00:08:52.040 video game of the famous role-playing game. 00:08:52.040 --> 00:08:55.760 Excuse me, and Dungeons and Dragons, 00:08:55.760 --> 00:08:58.760 famous Dragons and Dungeons. 00:08:59.360 --> 00:09:03.360 From transmedia narratives, gamification, role-playing 00:09:03.360 --> 00:09:08.320 games, board game games, always revolving around that medieval period. 00:09:08.720 --> 00:09:11.120 Last month, taking advantage of the. 00:09:11.120 --> 00:09:15.120 On Book Day, we also celebrate the meeting, our first 00:09:15.120 --> 00:09:19.120 medieval event, focused precisely on that children's 00:09:19.120 --> 00:09:24.880 and young adult literature that rescues, imagines, and dreams of the Middle Ages. 00:09:24.880 --> 00:09:27.920 Sometimes a rosy medieval era, other 00:09:27.920 --> 00:09:30.920 times a barbaric medieval era. 00:09:30.920 --> 00:09:34.920 But it has had notable prestigious authors, 00:09:34.920 --> 00:09:38.920 both international, as you all know, that 00:09:38.920 --> 00:09:42.920 it has read Tolkien, but also Laura Gallego 00:09:42.920 --> 00:09:46.920 and so many others, in the saga of productions, 00:09:46.920 --> 00:09:50.920 both narrative and on screen, as well known 00:09:50.920 --> 00:09:54.320 as Game, as Game of Thrones. 00:09:54.760 --> 00:09:58.760 Also, the meetings that have been taking place 00:09:58.760 --> 00:10:02.760 for years, Middle Ages, Multimedia, Middle 00:10:02.760 --> 00:10:06.760 Ages, Transmedia, Middle Ages, Mass Media, 00:10:06.760 --> 00:10:10.760 the last of which you have on the screen, was 00:10:10.760 --> 00:10:14.760 held in September 2025 in collaboration with 00:10:14.760 --> 00:10:18.760 the University of Buenos Aires and the Federal 00:10:18.760 --> 00:10:22.760 Rural University of Rio de Janeiro, and for 00:10:22.760 --> 00:10:26.760 next year we already have the 4th edition 00:10:26.760 --> 00:10:30.760 underway and also to give continuity, to give 00:10:30.760 --> 00:10:34.760 visibility, we consider it absolutely necessary 00:10:34.760 --> 00:10:38.760 that this line of study had an academic platform 00:10:38.760 --> 00:10:42.760 where to disseminate and make known the works 00:10:42.760 --> 00:10:46.440 that sometimes arise from these meetings. 00:10:46.440 --> 00:10:51.240 This is the non-medieval magazine that you have in the. 00:10:51.240 --> 00:10:55.240 The screen that is currently preparing 00:10:55.240 --> 00:10:59.240 its 5th issue should show this in June of 00:10:59.240 --> 00:11:02.960 this year and that has an open call for 00:11:02.960 --> 00:11:05.960 submissions in December. 00:11:06.440 --> 00:11:10.440 This monograph, as you see on the screen, also deals 00:11:10.440 --> 00:11:14.440 with the eternal return of a malleable king, the 00:11:14.440 --> 00:11:18.440 reception and reinterpretation of the Arthurian 00:11:18.440 --> 00:11:22.440 myth in contemporary culture from the 19th to the 00:11:22.440 --> 00:11:26.440 21st centuries, directed by Julio San Ramón, San 00:11:26.440 --> 00:11:30.200 Román, Cazorla, currently at the University of Oviedo. 00:11:30.200 --> 00:11:35.000 We hope that this platform will continue to host works that... 00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:39.240 That it has dissemination, that it serves 00:11:39.240 --> 00:11:43.240 as a meeting place for academics, scholars 00:11:43.240 --> 00:11:47.240 and teachers in general, and with this, 00:11:47.240 --> 00:11:51.240 making known these initiatives of both 00:11:51.240 --> 00:11:55.240 teachers from the Rey Juan Carlos University 00:11:55.240 --> 00:11:59.240 and from related groups with whom we have 00:11:59.240 --> 00:12:03.560 been collaborating for a long, long time. 00:12:04.160 --> 00:12:08.160 Here beside me is Professor Israel San Martín, with 00:12:08.160 --> 00:12:12.160 Azucena, Don Fervor de Diego, Brais Pablo Fernández, 00:12:12.160 --> 00:12:16.160 with whom we have been meeting and meeting both here in 00:12:16.160 --> 00:12:20.160 Madrid and at the University of Santiago, trying to 00:12:20.160 --> 00:12:24.160 explain, to study, what medievalism is, how it arrives, 00:12:24.160 --> 00:12:28.160 how it is received, how it is rewritten, how the Middle 00:12:28.160 --> 00:12:32.720 Ages is reformulated, both from the 19th century to the present day. 00:12:33.000 --> 00:12:37.000 Also Pilar Garrido Clemente, Jacobo Hernando 00:12:37.000 --> 00:12:41.000 Morejón, from the University of Murcia, whose 00:12:41.000 --> 00:12:45.000 congress on the subject is the oldest. The call 00:12:45.000 --> 00:12:49.000 for contributions for the 6th Congress that 00:12:49.000 --> 00:12:52.400 it will organize this September. 00:12:52.560 --> 00:12:56.560 In short, these are actions that I believe already have 00:12:56.560 --> 00:13:00.560 a certain tradition, a certain solidity, in which many 00:13:00.560 --> 00:13:04.560 of us are involved and in which we want to increasingly 00:13:04.560 --> 00:13:08.560 involve more people, more teachers, more researchers, 00:13:08.560 --> 00:13:12.560 because we believe that there is still much to say regarding 00:13:12.560 --> 00:13:15.920 the historical novel of the 19th century. 00:13:15.920 --> 00:13:19.920 Does one think of the catalogs still 00:13:19.920 --> 00:13:23.920 of Ferreras, of the great writers, 00:13:23.920 --> 00:13:27.920 the great cultivators of the genre 00:13:27.920 --> 00:13:31.920 like Fernández Díaz and González, 00:13:31.920 --> 00:13:37.880 with such vast productions, or Ortega Ortega and Frías? 00:13:37.880 --> 00:13:41.880 So much so that it gives so much power to analyze, to see how that imaginary is 00:13:41.880 --> 00:13:46.120 constructed that distinguishes it or that takes advantage of the gothic narrative. 00:13:46.400 --> 00:13:50.400 We will have for the first one tomorrow when 00:13:50.400 --> 00:13:54.400 Carlos Mata falls also to Miriam, to Miriam, 00:13:54.400 --> 00:13:58.400 what what Santos and as Maria, or as that 00:13:58.400 --> 00:14:02.400 imaginary around Almería is recreated, 00:14:02.400 --> 00:14:06.400 sometimes manipulated, sometimes reused 00:14:06.400 --> 00:14:10.400 and several also transforms into some in some 00:14:10.400 --> 00:14:14.400 basic issues it is maintained from the 19th 00:14:14.400 --> 00:14:18.400 to the 20th and in and in our days, going from 00:14:18.400 --> 00:14:21.600 the novel, the comic to the to the screen. 00:14:21.600 --> 00:14:22.400 Video games. 00:14:22.400 --> 00:14:27.920 So many formats, so many works, so many authors, and so much to do. 00:14:27.920 --> 00:14:31.920 Let this humble day serve as a 00:14:31.920 --> 00:14:35.920 launching pad, as a meeting place, 00:14:35.920 --> 00:14:40.280 as a space for dialogue, so that we can. 00:14:40.400 --> 00:14:41.480 That we can do it. 00:14:41.480 --> 00:14:45.480 Thank you all very much, and now in a few minutes we will 00:14:45.480 --> 00:14:49.480 properly begin the meeting with the first of the conferences 00:14:49.480 --> 00:14:54.160 we have, which will be given by Professor Israel San Martín. 00:14:54.200 --> 00:14:55.040 Thanks a lot. 00:14:58.560 --> 00:15:00.920 we're going to 00:15:00.920 --> 00:15:04.920 Let's begin with the program of the conference, 00:15:04.920 --> 00:15:08.920 and we will do so with the opening lecture by 00:15:08.920 --> 00:15:12.920 Professor Israel San Martín from the University 00:15:12.920 --> 00:15:16.080 of Santiago de Compostela, entitled 00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:19.080 Medieval Historiography. 00:15:19.880 --> 00:15:23.880 In the 19th century, Israel San Martín was a professor in the area of ​​Medieval 00:15:23.880 --> 00:15:27.320 History at the Faculty of Geography and History of the University of Santiago de 00:15:27.320 --> 00:15:29.040 Compostela. 00:15:29.760 --> 00:15:33.440 His lines of research are the history of medieval millenarianism. 00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:35.880 Historiography and history. 00:15:35.880 --> 00:15:37.320 Medieval historiography. 00:15:37.320 --> 00:15:41.520 Digital history and travel books in the Middle Ages. 00:15:41.880 --> 00:15:45.880 He is the author of the book Between Two Centuries: 00:15:45.880 --> 00:15:49.880 Globalization and Single Thought, published by the local 00:15:49.880 --> 00:15:53.880 publisher in 2007, and editor of the books, Histories, 00:15:53.880 --> 00:15:57.880 Images and Languages, Temporality and Contexts and the 00:15:57.880 --> 00:16:01.880 Historiographical Debate on the End of History in Francis 00:16:01.880 --> 00:16:05.880 Fukuyama. He has organized various international 00:16:05.880 --> 00:16:09.880 conferences, such as the Virtual International Congress 00:16:09.880 --> 00:16:13.880 of Medieval Eschatology, held at the University of Santiago 00:16:13.880 --> 00:16:17.880 de Compostela in 2021, as well as numerous meetings related 00:16:17.880 --> 00:16:21.880 to the theme of the event for which we are gathered here today, 00:16:21.880 --> 00:16:25.880 such as the workshop Thinking about the Contemporary Middle 00:16:25.880 --> 00:16:29.880 Ages, held at the Faculty of Geography and History of the 00:16:29.880 --> 00:16:33.840 University of Santiago de Compostela on April 17 and 18, 2023. 00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:38.200 The International Colloquium "Historiography in 00:16:38.200 --> 00:16:42.200 the Long Middle Ages," which was also held at the Faculty 00:16:42.200 --> 00:16:46.200 of Geography and History of the University of Santiago 00:16:46.200 --> 00:16:50.200 from February 26 to 28, 2024, or the International 00:16:50.200 --> 00:16:54.200 Conference on Neo-Medievalism, organized by the 00:16:54.200 --> 00:16:58.200 YAKO research group and held at the University of 00:16:58.200 --> 00:17:02.200 Santiago de Compostela on June 17, 2024, have been 00:17:02.200 --> 00:17:06.200 part of different research projects, among which the 00:17:06.200 --> 00:17:10.200 following stand out: "Full Medieval Millenarianism, 00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:14.200 History and Geography, Image," sponsored by the Junta 00:17:14.200 --> 00:17:18.200 de Galicia, in which Professor San Martín acted as 00:17:18.200 --> 00:17:22.200 principal investigator. He has also recently 00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:26.200 coordinated a valuable monograph on the literature 00:17:26.200 --> 00:17:30.200 about the Camino de Santiago, which has appeared in 00:17:30.200 --> 00:17:34.200 the journal AD Elimina, and has been, I believe, one 00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:38.040 of the fundamental pillars, one of the supports, 00:17:38.040 --> 00:17:41.040 also of the professors of this, of this house. 00:17:41.320 --> 00:17:45.320 In that series of meetings, debates, and 00:17:45.320 --> 00:17:49.320 dialogues about the medieval year, how do 00:17:49.320 --> 00:17:53.320 we study how we approach that medieval 00:17:53.320 --> 00:17:59.040 imaginary today, without further ado, without the Middle Ages, eh? 00:17:59.040 --> 00:18:03.440 Literary, medieval, from the screen and so many others. 00:18:03.600 --> 00:18:07.360 Others we measured. Perhaps it's not a no, it's a unique medieval period. 00:18:07.360 --> 00:18:11.360 I always thank him for the enthusiasm shown 00:18:11.360 --> 00:18:15.360 in the different projects for the teaching 00:18:15.360 --> 00:18:19.360 he has also exercised with his pupils, with 00:18:19.360 --> 00:18:23.360 his disciples Yago, Azucena, Eh, Pablo, 00:18:23.360 --> 00:18:27.360 who have also been, uh, a fundamental part 00:18:27.360 --> 00:18:31.360 of all these meetings both in the organization 00:18:31.360 --> 00:18:34.360 and the reflections. 00:18:34.680 --> 00:18:38.680 And well, I have the pleasure of calling Professor 00:18:38.680 --> 00:18:42.680 Israel San Martín my friend, so I welcome you, I thank 00:18:42.680 --> 00:18:47.080 you for being here, and whenever you dear Israel, you can begin. 00:18:47.080 --> 00:18:51.080 Thank you very much for including us once 00:18:51.080 --> 00:18:55.080 again in these third conferences, which 00:18:55.080 --> 00:18:59.080 began three years ago, and the possibility 00:18:59.080 --> 00:19:03.080 of holding them every year is an incentive 00:19:03.080 --> 00:19:07.080 to continue reflecting on the historical 00:19:07.080 --> 00:19:11.080 novel in the 19th century and everything 00:19:11.080 --> 00:19:15.080 surrounding the historical novel in 00:19:15.080 --> 00:19:18.720 the 19th century. 00:19:18.720 --> 00:19:22.640 Precisely, as Professor Huertas explained, this year, eh? 00:19:22.640 --> 00:19:26.640 There's also a lot of context that will help us understand 00:19:26.640 --> 00:19:30.640 the historical novels of the 19th century themselves, huh? 00:19:30.640 --> 00:19:32.760 Philosophical questions, huh? 00:19:32.760 --> 00:19:37.440 Questions, uh, of historiography, questions. 00:19:37.440 --> 00:19:41.440 Therefore, between history, literature, 00:19:41.440 --> 00:19:45.440 philosophy, and political science, 00:19:45.440 --> 00:19:49.440 in which, uh, as I say, uh, they create, 00:19:49.440 --> 00:19:53.440 uh, a space mmm, truly of confluence 00:19:53.440 --> 00:19:57.240 between different researchers and 00:19:57.240 --> 00:20:00.240 different disciplines. 00:20:01.640 --> 00:20:04.680 Huh? Mmm. 00:20:04.840 --> 00:20:10.080 Today I'm going to focus on medieval history in the 19th century. 00:20:10.920 --> 00:20:16.720 And I'm going to focus on medieval historiography in the 19th century. 00:20:17.000 --> 00:20:21.000 From an analytical point of view of how we 00:20:21.000 --> 00:20:26.920 have thought about medieval historiography in the 19th century. 00:20:27.840 --> 00:20:31.840 In general terms, we have considered the general 00:20:31.840 --> 00:20:35.840 historiography of the 19th century as a 00:20:35.840 --> 00:20:40.800 historiography where the medieval has an important presence 00:20:40.920 --> 00:20:43.920 And one. Mmm 00:20:44.040 --> 00:20:48.040 an important function which is to serve as 00:20:48.040 --> 00:20:52.040 justification for the different political 00:20:52.040 --> 00:20:55.440 projects that are being built in this 19th century. 00:20:55.440 --> 00:20:59.440 Therefore, the Middle Ages in the 19th century EH 00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:02.560 acquires an instrumental character. 00:21:03.120 --> 00:21:07.120 In a way, this idea has been the one that 00:21:07.120 --> 00:21:10.320 EH has agreed upon in this Middle 00:21:10.320 --> 00:21:13.320 Ages of the 19th century. 00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:20.400 If we look at practical cases, that consensus obviously works, right? 00:21:20.640 --> 00:21:24.640 In other words, the different materials 00:21:24.640 --> 00:21:28.640 we can consult show us that the media 00:21:28.640 --> 00:21:32.640 served for these projects, both 00:21:32.640 --> 00:21:38.120 intellectual and political, of the 19th century. 00:21:39.720 --> 00:21:40.520 Okay, mmm. 00:21:40.520 --> 00:21:42.840 Which 00:21:42.840 --> 00:21:46.840 Um, I propose, uh, today is precisely to 00:21:46.840 --> 00:21:50.840 reflect a little on that and point out some 00:21:50.840 --> 00:21:54.760 ideas that perhaps, uh, can lead to other 00:21:54.760 --> 00:21:57.760 reflections parallel to this one. 00:21:58.680 --> 00:22:04.440 The first one is precisely this idea of ​​consensus as, uh, mmm. 00:22:04.640 --> 00:22:08.640 We have agreed on the historiography of the 00:22:08.640 --> 00:22:12.480 19th century in a certain way. Who has agreed 00:22:12.480 --> 00:22:15.480 on it and how has it been agreed on? 00:22:15.840 --> 00:22:21.240 This maxim that I have explained has practically no answer. 00:22:21.240 --> 00:22:25.240 Isn't it as if there were a public space, a cultural field or 00:22:25.240 --> 00:22:29.200 a historiographical field where no one says otherwise? 00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:32.200 thing, huh? 00:22:32.280 --> 00:22:37.840 Professor Rebecca San Martín has hinted at this in some of her work. 00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:39.400 That? 00:22:39.400 --> 00:22:43.920 Hmm, not just the resource, the Middle Ages, huh? 00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:47.920 This 19th has a political consideration, 00:22:47.920 --> 00:22:51.920 but also an aesthetic consideration, an 00:22:51.920 --> 00:22:55.920 environmental consideration, a 00:22:55.920 --> 00:22:59.920 consideration of, mmm, compensation in 00:22:59.920 --> 00:23:03.640 the face of a very difficult reality, right? 00:23:04.240 --> 00:23:04.920 Uh, maybe. 00:23:04.920 --> 00:23:08.640 So, that opens up some possibilities for 00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:11.640 reflection on this issue, doesn't it? 00:23:11.640 --> 00:23:15.640 In other words, media is not only used for the 00:23:15.640 --> 00:23:19.640 political construction of our nations, of 00:23:19.640 --> 00:23:23.640 our states, but it also has an aesthetic 00:23:23.640 --> 00:23:27.640 function, an environmental function, a mental 00:23:27.640 --> 00:23:30.840 function, and an escape from reality. 00:23:31.520 --> 00:23:34.520 Good, huh? 00:23:36.120 --> 00:23:39.120 That would imply something. 00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:48.000 Correcting it would mean discussing that consensual idea that 00:23:48.000 --> 00:23:51.640 was created about the Middle Ages in the 19th century. 00:23:51.640 --> 00:23:55.640 But beyond whether or not we want to introduce 00:23:55.640 --> 00:23:59.640 this idea, this fracture in the consensus, I 00:23:59.640 --> 00:24:03.640 would like to introduce another issue that 00:24:03.640 --> 00:24:07.640 seems important to me and for which the historical 00:24:07.640 --> 00:24:10.640 novel is responsible, or partly 00:24:10.640 --> 00:24:13.640 responsible, which is the audience. 00:24:14.240 --> 00:24:17.840 We don't have two concepts. Therefore, the concept of consensus and the concept 00:24:17.840 --> 00:24:19.640 of audience. 00:24:19.640 --> 00:24:23.640 The medieval history of the 19th century is linked 00:24:23.640 --> 00:24:26.760 to the audience, it is linked to being 00:24:26.760 --> 00:24:29.760 read, it is linked to dissemination. 00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:34.240 We will give different examples, and this also seems to me to be 00:24:34.240 --> 00:24:38.240 fundamental to breaking that consensual idea created from the 00:24:38.240 --> 00:24:42.600 creative centers of the creative elites, from the historiographical ones. 00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:45.960 consolidated. 00:24:46.480 --> 00:24:48.440 In addition to 00:24:48.440 --> 00:24:52.440 These introductions of rupture, consensus, 00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:56.440 and the emergence of the audience—I want 00:24:56.440 --> 00:25:00.440 to introduce two more issues. Right? 00:25:01.080 --> 00:25:05.080 And that also leads us to reflect on something that 00:25:05.080 --> 00:25:09.080 Professor Huertas has put in the titles of his 00:25:09.080 --> 00:25:13.080 conferences, which is Transmedia Middle Ages, 00:25:13.080 --> 00:25:17.840 that is, now we talk about transmedia narratives as an argument. 00:25:17.840 --> 00:25:21.080 We can see it in different formats. 00:25:21.200 --> 00:25:25.200 Not on YouTube or social media, but in a newspaper, a 00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:29.080 novel, etc. And we call that, uh, materialistic media 00:25:29.080 --> 00:25:32.080 in the Middle Ages of the 19th century. 00:25:32.680 --> 00:25:36.080 We could also consider it, therefore, a transmedia 00:25:36.080 --> 00:25:39.080 age, not novels, stories, or source editions. 00:25:39.080 --> 00:25:43.080 In other words, everything is already 00:25:43.080 --> 00:25:47.080 present here; we should tell Scolari, who 00:25:47.080 --> 00:25:51.080 is one of the theorists of transmedia 00:25:51.080 --> 00:25:55.080 narratives, that he could revisit the 19th 00:25:55.080 --> 00:25:59.280 century to complement these reflections in some way. 00:25:59.480 --> 00:26:03.480 On the other hand, the concept of post-truth 00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:07.320 has also been used nowadays, especially 00:26:07.320 --> 00:26:10.320 since 2007-2008. Right? 00:26:10.360 --> 00:26:13.360 Which is not the same as the concept of lying. 00:26:13.600 --> 00:26:15.800 The lie, huh? 00:26:15.800 --> 00:26:17.960 He is aware that there is a truth. 00:26:17.960 --> 00:26:20.760 I lie, but I know there is a truth. 00:26:20.760 --> 00:26:26.440 I can say this is NASA, but I know it's King Juan Carlos University. 00:26:26.760 --> 00:26:28.680 I know I'm telling a lie. 00:26:28.680 --> 00:26:32.640 Post-truth isn't interested in truth, nor is it interested in lies, huh? 00:26:32.720 --> 00:26:35.280 Opinion and emotion. 00:26:35.280 --> 00:26:37.520 Truth is replaced by emotion. 00:26:37.520 --> 00:26:40.520 And that happens all the time in the 19th century. 00:26:40.520 --> 00:26:44.520 Therefore, in those consensual nineteenth-century 00:26:44.520 --> 00:26:48.520 spaces, in those audiences that are sought out and 00:26:48.520 --> 00:26:52.520 that form part of the public space of the 19th century, 00:26:52.520 --> 00:26:56.520 this idea that has been called post-truth is also 00:26:56.520 --> 00:27:00.520 systematically present, because the 19th century 00:27:00.520 --> 00:27:04.520 is the century of emotions, it is a century precisely 00:27:04.520 --> 00:27:08.280 generated and built from these ideas. 00:27:09.400 --> 00:27:12.240 What do I mean by this? 00:27:12.240 --> 00:27:16.240 To begin with, I want to say that it seems like we are discovering 00:27:16.240 --> 00:27:20.200 the Mediterranean, or it seems like they are discovering the Mediterranean right 00:27:20.200 --> 00:27:22.200 now. 00:27:22.200 --> 00:27:26.200 Many authors, based on these transmedia 00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:30.200 reflections with concepts such as post-truth, 00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:34.200 are constantly circulating and generating 00:27:34.200 --> 00:27:38.200 these ideas, not with these concepts, but 00:27:38.200 --> 00:27:42.520 with others, since at least the 19th century. 00:27:43.000 --> 00:27:47.000 Do not consider this as a kind of genealogy 00:27:47.000 --> 00:27:51.000 of ideas, but simply as a visitation of this 00:27:51.000 --> 00:27:55.000 19th-century present, where we can calmly, 00:27:55.000 --> 00:27:59.000 uh, identify things that we think are novel 00:27:59.000 --> 00:28:02.520 today and that are working in that 00:28:02.520 --> 00:28:05.520 19th-century historiography. 00:28:07.000 --> 00:28:11.080 So, uh, the motivations, huh? 00:28:11.520 --> 00:28:15.520 These reflections lead us to, uh, something that 00:28:15.520 --> 00:28:19.200 is also supposedly developing today, right? 00:28:20.040 --> 00:28:24.040 The other day I was listening to one of the 00:28:24.040 --> 00:28:28.040 historians who influence the Spanish 00:28:28.040 --> 00:28:32.040 public sphere, José Javier Esparza, 00:28:32.040 --> 00:28:35.440 talking about the historians' dispute. 00:28:35.440 --> 00:28:39.440 This dispute among historians is a struggle between professional 00:28:39.440 --> 00:28:42.600 historians and historians who aren't professionals, who aren't in academia. 00:28:42.600 --> 00:28:44.200 Right? 00:28:46.120 --> 00:28:49.120 That lawsuit. 00:28:49.240 --> 00:28:53.240 We will also find the professionalization 00:28:53.240 --> 00:28:57.240 of history and non-professional historians 00:28:57.240 --> 00:29:02.640 in the 19th century, but with an essential characteristic 00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:04.760 in Spain 00:29:04.760 --> 00:29:08.760 which Spanish historians took a 00:29:08.760 --> 00:29:11.800 long time to construct, huh? 00:29:11.800 --> 00:29:15.040 His own professional history. 00:29:15.040 --> 00:29:19.040 And when they did, they did so from a legal perspective; 00:29:19.040 --> 00:29:22.880 fundamentally, historians, the great historians of 00:29:22.880 --> 00:29:25.880 this time, are basically historians of law. 00:29:27.040 --> 00:29:31.040 There is a special case like Rafael Altamira, etc., 00:29:31.040 --> 00:29:35.040 but I think that's important because it allows us to 00:29:35.040 --> 00:29:39.040 see that many historical novelists are and act as 00:29:39.040 --> 00:29:42.520 historians, and they consider themselves as such. 00:29:44.360 --> 00:29:46.320 Even afterwards, huh? 00:29:46.320 --> 00:29:50.320 For me, the important thing, theoretically 00:29:50.320 --> 00:29:54.320 in this reflection, is the reflection on the 00:29:54.320 --> 00:29:58.320 public space or the public sphere, which is 00:29:58.320 --> 00:30:02.320 the place that is created from liberal states, 00:30:02.320 --> 00:30:06.320 where, well, in this case from liberal states, 00:30:06.320 --> 00:30:10.320 different ideas circulate, intellectual 00:30:10.320 --> 00:30:14.320 ideas, ideas of politicians, ideas of 00:30:14.320 --> 00:30:17.800 historians, ideas from power, ideas, 00:30:17.800 --> 00:30:20.800 demands from the audiences, etc. 00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:25.000 That public space which, over time, was later created 00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:29.000 by public opinion, is a concept that derives from or 00:30:29.000 --> 00:30:34.320 has been explained by the recently deceased Jürgen Habermas. 00:30:35.600 --> 00:30:39.400 And as I was saying before, for me the birth of the audience is important in 00:30:39.400 --> 00:30:41.320 this 19th-century history. 00:30:41.680 --> 00:30:45.680 In other words, when we study history, whether 00:30:45.680 --> 00:30:49.680 now or whenever, we don't care about the audience 00:30:49.680 --> 00:30:53.000 and we don't have to pay attention to it. 00:30:53.000 --> 00:30:57.000 But here, many of the examples we're going to see in the 00:30:57.000 --> 00:31:01.000 19th century are based on the audience, and we have to 00:31:01.000 --> 00:31:04.480 incorporate that into the study of the 19th century. 00:31:07.000 --> 00:31:11.400 Okay, what I'm about to say comes with this outline, right? 00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:15.640 I'm going to start with a series of preliminary 00:31:15.640 --> 00:31:21.040 considerations, uh, more reflective in the sense of how I started. 00:31:21.400 --> 00:31:25.400 Next, I will give four examples from 19th-century 00:31:25.400 --> 00:31:29.920 historiography, starting from the Middle Ages. 00:31:30.040 --> 00:31:34.040 The year 1000, historiographical 00:31:34.040 --> 00:31:38.040 colonization, the historical 00:31:38.040 --> 00:31:42.040 novel, and animal trials are four 00:31:42.040 --> 00:31:46.040 examples that derive not from a 00:31:46.040 --> 00:31:50.040 position of visiting, but from a 00:31:50.040 --> 00:31:53.680 position of working, of practice. 00:31:53.760 --> 00:31:56.560 Therefore, the reflection I am going to make is a theoretical and practical 00:31:56.560 --> 00:31:57.960 reflection. 00:31:59.080 --> 00:32:03.080 It stems from practice, not 00:32:03.080 --> 00:32:07.080 from useless theoretical 00:32:07.080 --> 00:32:12.520 pedaling with no connection to it. 00:32:13.200 --> 00:32:16.200 Research practice. 00:32:16.960 --> 00:32:18.840 Good, huh? 00:32:18.840 --> 00:32:22.840 Perhaps to begin with, with these preliminary considerations, eh? 00:32:23.480 --> 00:32:25.720 How have we constructed the historiography of the 19th century? 00:32:25.720 --> 00:32:29.680 We don't have Agotes, we have Moreno Alonso, 00:32:29.680 --> 00:32:32.680 eh, for Spain, for Europe. 00:32:32.680 --> 00:32:36.680 In other words, these are the great books that we, who have been 00:32:36.680 --> 00:32:40.680 interested in some way in the historiography of the 19th 00:32:40.680 --> 00:32:44.680 century, go through, and how from many of these texts and many 00:32:44.680 --> 00:32:48.680 others, well, those consensuses are created, those consensuses 00:32:48.680 --> 00:32:52.680 in historiography, etc. Because, let's see, the consensus 00:32:52.680 --> 00:32:56.680 in the historiography of the 19th century is basically one 00:32:56.680 --> 00:33:00.640 that happens in the historiography of the 19th century. 00:33:01.920 --> 00:33:05.920 Work begins with documents, and 00:33:05.920 --> 00:33:09.920 this work with documents leads 00:33:09.920 --> 00:33:14.200 to history becoming a science. 00:33:15.520 --> 00:33:17.480 That's the consensus. 00:33:17.480 --> 00:33:18.680 OK. 00:33:18.680 --> 00:33:20.360 What's happening? 00:33:20.360 --> 00:33:24.320 We can refine that consensus a lot, and we can refine it based on these four 00:33:24.320 --> 00:33:26.320 examples. 00:33:26.320 --> 00:33:29.320 For example, they have nothing to do with each other, right? 00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:35.920 In many cases with, with, with, with professional history, etc. 00:33:36.520 --> 00:33:40.520 If we look, for example, at Larra or any 00:33:40.520 --> 00:33:44.520 19th-century novelist, we will see that he 00:33:44.520 --> 00:33:50.000 thinks he is working seriously with sources as if they were historians. 00:33:50.920 --> 00:33:54.640 Well, public space is not Habermas's idea. 00:33:54.640 --> 00:33:56.640 We have already announced this. 00:33:56.640 --> 00:34:00.640 The importance of public space, the inclusion of 00:34:00.640 --> 00:34:05.560 19th-century historiography in a public space that belongs to it. 00:34:05.560 --> 00:34:09.160 Public space, therefore, has the cultural field, the historiographical field. 00:34:09.400 --> 00:34:13.400 But we're staying within the realm of public 00:34:13.400 --> 00:34:17.400 space because public space is going to be 00:34:17.400 --> 00:34:21.400 fundamental to explaining the birth of the 00:34:21.400 --> 00:34:25.400 audience and how, uh, that public space, uh, 00:34:25.400 --> 00:34:30.040 makes us think about the 19th century in a consensual way, right? 00:34:30.040 --> 00:34:34.040 The consensual historiographical form has been 00:34:34.040 --> 00:34:38.040 described as the history of the 19th century as 00:34:38.040 --> 00:34:41.200 something totally linked to the use of 00:34:41.200 --> 00:34:44.200 documents and to turning history into a science. 00:34:44.200 --> 00:34:48.040 That's the consensus, the consensus. 00:34:48.040 --> 00:34:52.040 Habermas' idea of ​​consensus has an important limitation, 00:34:52.040 --> 00:34:56.040 which is that it does not contemplate opposition, because 00:34:56.040 --> 00:34:59.480 Habermas says that consensus is reached through 00:34:59.480 --> 00:35:02.480 dialogue and the confrontation of opinions. 00:35:02.480 --> 00:35:06.480 But who makes the consensus, who establishes 00:35:06.480 --> 00:35:10.480 what the history of the 19th century should be? 00:35:10.480 --> 00:35:14.480 The elites, the historiographical elites, 00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:18.480 the educational elites, the powerful, and so 00:35:18.480 --> 00:35:22.480 on. That's why some authors speak of a public 00:35:22.480 --> 00:35:26.480 or positional space, that is, a public space 00:35:26.480 --> 00:35:30.480 where one intervenes without the need for 00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:33.800 consensus, where different forms of... 00:35:34.560 --> 00:35:37.560 understand mmm 00:35:38.040 --> 00:35:40.600 that 19th-century historiography. 00:35:40.600 --> 00:35:44.600 At the present moment we are facing a public space that 00:35:44.600 --> 00:35:50.320 is tremendously compositional, not one of rupture, lack of dialogue, etc. 00:35:50.920 --> 00:35:54.920 And that's also important to recognize, 00:35:54.920 --> 00:35:58.920 because it also has, uh, mmm, an epistemic 00:35:58.920 --> 00:36:03.000 dimension to what's happening. 00:36:04.600 --> 00:36:07.600 The elites are. 00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:11.160 How do elites reproduce themselves? How are these 00:36:11.160 --> 00:36:14.160 historiographical elites of different authors created? 00:36:14.840 --> 00:36:16.960 Consensus, etc.? 00:36:16.960 --> 00:36:20.960 There's also an important issue that 00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:24.960 history has generally agreed is something 00:36:24.960 --> 00:36:28.200 to be left out: fiction. Right? 00:36:28.200 --> 00:36:31.160 And this is where the historical novel comes in. 00:36:31.160 --> 00:36:35.640 Is the historical novel fiction, or is it actually a negotiation between the two? 00:36:35.640 --> 00:36:39.040 Antonio said now in the presentation, that's the answer of a 00:36:39.040 --> 00:36:42.040 historical novelist who renounces the historical novel. 00:36:44.400 --> 00:36:49.080 To position fiction well, we have to integrate it. 00:36:49.080 --> 00:36:53.080 And often fiction says more about reality, 00:36:53.080 --> 00:36:57.080 and more realistic things, than reality 00:36:57.080 --> 00:37:01.080 itself, the study of historical sources, 00:37:01.080 --> 00:37:05.400 etc., which is often very latent and very mediated. 00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:08.840 That's the case with what Hayden White explained to us. Right? 00:37:11.120 --> 00:37:14.680 Also the place from which we are speaking, of course. 00:37:15.600 --> 00:37:18.880 What is the historiography when we talk about the 19th century? 00:37:18.880 --> 00:37:23.040 What is French history, Spanish history, Galician history? 00:37:23.520 --> 00:37:26.080 Which? 00:37:26.080 --> 00:37:29.080 And what if we talk about which one? 00:37:29.440 --> 00:37:33.280 What are the characteristics or what is the situation regarding? 00:37:33.960 --> 00:37:37.960 In other words, we have to explain that Spain in the 19th 00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:41.960 century is already a historiographical periphery, it 00:37:41.960 --> 00:37:46.480 is an autarkic place, etc. But we see a case of how this works. 00:37:51.080 --> 00:37:54.800 Medievalism, huh? Medievalism, huh? 00:37:54.800 --> 00:38:00.280 It is the study of the medieval outside of the Middle Ages in the 19th century. 00:38:00.280 --> 00:38:04.280 We have medievalism. Some authors have introduced, such as 00:38:04.280 --> 00:38:08.280 Professor Huertas, this idea of ​​a contemporary Middle Ages 00:38:08.280 --> 00:38:12.000 that we can calmly apply to this moment and to other people, other young people, 00:38:12.000 --> 00:38:13.880 for example. 00:38:13.880 --> 00:38:17.880 Isn't that the case of the researcher Azucena Don 00:38:17.880 --> 00:38:23.400 Carbó, who is coining the concept of the nineteenth-century Middle Ages? 00:38:23.640 --> 00:38:27.640 So, this is an emerging field, 00:38:27.640 --> 00:38:31.640 as Antonio said before, a field 00:38:31.640 --> 00:38:37.480 that some might call innovative in Spain? 00:38:38.320 --> 00:38:41.640 And we can't ignore all of this, can we? 00:38:41.960 --> 00:38:45.960 Since there are already tools to study this 00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:49.920 19th-century Middle Ages, let's look at some examples. 00:38:53.240 --> 00:38:57.240 Huh? The 19th century made us revisit, 00:38:57.240 --> 00:39:00.840 made us update many things, 00:39:01.480 --> 00:39:04.480 many topics. 00:39:05.720 --> 00:39:09.720 Ideologically, uh, politically, 00:39:09.720 --> 00:39:15.320 mmm, literarily, with many nuances. 00:39:15.320 --> 00:39:17.280 Historically. Why not? 00:39:17.280 --> 00:39:19.160 One of them is the year 1000. 00:39:19.160 --> 00:39:22.240 There is a year 1000 that happened in the 11th century or did 00:39:22.240 --> 00:39:25.240 not happen in the 11th century, The terrors of the year 1000. 00:39:25.240 --> 00:39:29.240 I am referring to the presence of the end of the world 00:39:29.240 --> 00:39:34.360 in the 11th century itself and how that was used in a certain way. 00:39:34.720 --> 00:39:37.120 Policy 00:39:37.120 --> 00:39:41.440 in a historiographical way in the 19th century. 00:39:41.440 --> 00:39:44.440 French, eh, eh! 00:39:44.800 --> 00:39:47.240 And a debate ensued. 00:39:47.240 --> 00:39:49.360 that eh 00:39:49.360 --> 00:39:53.360 It continues to this day, and it is 00:39:53.360 --> 00:39:57.360 whether the terrors of the year 1000 00:39:57.360 --> 00:40:01.040 existed or whether the terrors of 00:40:01.040 --> 00:40:04.040 the year 1000 did not exist. 00:40:05.360 --> 00:40:08.560 Different authors here have Michel as a rider, 00:40:08.640 --> 00:40:11.560 etcetera, eh? 00:40:11.560 --> 00:40:16.360 To amplify the idea that those terrors did indeed happen. 00:40:20.280 --> 00:40:21.880 Well, here's an example. 00:40:21.880 --> 00:40:24.040 No, it's not worth it. 00:40:24.040 --> 00:40:29.840 But there were also others who denied those terrors. 00:40:29.960 --> 00:40:32.680 No? And King 00:40:32.680 --> 00:40:34.040 Rosie Plain? 00:40:34.040 --> 00:40:38.040 Yes. Several historians began to deny the 00:40:38.040 --> 00:40:42.760 existence of those terrors as early as the year 1000. 00:40:42.760 --> 00:40:46.760 Many even suggested that the terrors of the year 1000 were 00:40:46.760 --> 00:40:50.600 instigated by the church to seize many properties. 00:40:52.280 --> 00:40:56.280 It is true that 11th-century France is full of myths, 00:40:56.280 --> 00:40:59.560 full of exploitation, full of false ideas. 00:40:59.560 --> 00:41:03.000 For example, another idea, a very controversial one, is that of the peace 00:41:03.000 --> 00:41:04.760 of God. 00:41:04.760 --> 00:41:06.240 No? What? Peace. 00:41:06.240 --> 00:41:09.240 No? Whether it's peace or war. 00:41:09.880 --> 00:41:10.720 Well, uh. 00:41:10.720 --> 00:41:13.720 Different. 00:41:16.120 --> 00:41:22.080 Texts that talk about the defenders, the year 1000, etc. 00:41:22.200 --> 00:41:23.720 We also have it in the year 1000. 00:41:25.720 --> 00:41:31.200 One important issue, which is the 00:41:31.600 --> 00:41:33.360 edition 00:41:33.360 --> 00:41:35.880 from the texts of the year 1000. 00:41:35.880 --> 00:41:39.880 For example, here we have, uh, an edition of El Cronista, 00:41:39.880 --> 00:41:43.880 one of the essential chroniclers of this year, 1001 is 00:41:43.880 --> 00:41:48.760 Glauber and others, in addition to shamans that we could have also brought. 00:41:49.000 --> 00:41:51.720 But fundamentally Glauber, eh? 00:41:51.720 --> 00:41:55.720 And this 19th-century edition, which is going to be 00:41:55.720 --> 00:41:59.720 important because it's going to be the source, the 00:41:59.720 --> 00:42:03.800 reference source for many of the novels, for many of the... 00:42:05.040 --> 00:42:09.280 Hey authors who are going to use this year a thousand. 00:42:11.520 --> 00:42:15.520 It is, therefore, you see, a question of, 00:42:15.520 --> 00:42:19.520 uh, uh, editing sources and a question of 00:42:19.520 --> 00:42:23.520 reflecting on what happens when defending 00:42:23.520 --> 00:42:27.480 the year 1000 or not defending the year 1000. 00:42:27.480 --> 00:42:29.560 The defenders of the year 1000. 00:42:29.560 --> 00:42:33.560 They're not very interested in the data, they're not 00:42:33.560 --> 00:42:37.560 very interested in the evidence. They're more interested 00:42:37.560 --> 00:42:41.360 in their emotions, in their opinions, right? No. 00:42:41.400 --> 00:42:46.760 In other words, it would be in the same direction, right? 00:42:49.120 --> 00:42:54.080 There is a very interesting text about the year 1000. 00:42:55.840 --> 00:42:56.480 Huh, what is it? 00:42:56.480 --> 00:43:00.520 It's by Jules Ray, who becomes Julio Rey 00:43:00.520 --> 00:43:03.520 in Spain. 00:43:03.640 --> 00:43:07.640 This text, uh, is originally in French and 00:43:07.640 --> 00:43:10.720 is translated in France itself. 00:43:12.120 --> 00:43:14.760 in Spanish 00:43:14.760 --> 00:43:16.720 and it is published in Spain. 00:43:16.720 --> 00:43:20.920 This text about the year 1000 is linked to a collection. 00:43:21.880 --> 00:43:23.720 Here you have both of them, huh? 00:43:23.720 --> 00:43:25.360 Julio Reis. 00:43:25.360 --> 00:43:27.920 Can you see it? 00:43:27.920 --> 00:43:33.880 It's the same book, right? It's linked to the Library of Wonders. 00:43:33.880 --> 00:43:38.360 The Library of Wonders is also one of the many libraries 00:43:39.120 --> 00:43:42.120 Oh, uh, uh, 00:43:42.280 --> 00:43:46.360 Publishing companies that emerged in the 19th century for dissemination. 00:43:47.520 --> 00:43:48.600 Is there disclosure? 00:43:48.600 --> 00:43:52.600 Many of these works circulated widely because 00:43:52.600 --> 00:43:56.600 there was dissemination, because there was 00:43:56.600 --> 00:44:00.600 an audience, and that audience was going to 00:44:00.600 --> 00:44:04.600 demand the library, right? The Library of 00:44:04.600 --> 00:44:08.600 Wonders had over 200 works and lasted from 00:44:08.600 --> 00:44:11.840 the 19th century until the 1930s. 00:44:12.760 --> 00:44:17.920 Did the driver get fed up? 00:44:18.240 --> 00:44:22.240 No? Is that the one with jazzed up 00:44:22.240 --> 00:44:25.960 the Luis phase of the publishing 00:44:25.960 --> 00:44:28.960 house's promoter, huh? 00:44:28.960 --> 00:44:32.960 Are they going to be the ones to launch this library 00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:37.640 that wanted to disseminate different wonderful topics, huh? 00:44:37.640 --> 00:44:41.200 There were astrological issues, etc., right? 00:44:41.880 --> 00:44:43.520 And this 00:44:43.520 --> 00:44:46.720 It is, uh, a point of friction with that 00:44:46.720 --> 00:44:49.720 consensus that is desired of us. 00:44:53.560 --> 00:44:58.960 Trying to build on the 19th century, right? 00:44:58.960 --> 00:45:02.960 The only concern is, uh, a concern about the 00:45:02.960 --> 00:45:06.760 evidence of the documents, etc., right? 00:45:07.560 --> 00:45:10.680 There is a concern for the dissemination 00:45:10.680 --> 00:45:13.680 of the wonderful, the magical, and so on. 00:45:15.040 --> 00:45:18.640 Sharpton was very successful; he was a man who was 00:45:18.640 --> 00:45:21.640 involved in various publishing projects. 00:45:22.000 --> 00:45:26.000 Well, this Library of Wonders is 00:45:26.000 --> 00:45:29.080 definitely worth studying. 00:45:30.160 --> 00:45:34.160 The book we are going to focus on is this book 00:45:34.160 --> 00:45:37.360 by a friar who is an intellectual. 00:45:37.360 --> 00:45:41.360 An academic from College Hart was in the School 00:45:41.360 --> 00:45:45.360 of Advanced Studies, uh, made his career as a 00:45:45.360 --> 00:45:49.360 great, uh, researcher of different subjects, 00:45:49.360 --> 00:45:54.520 etc. Uh, look, the collection that is blue in France 00:45:54.520 --> 00:45:58.960 It's red in Spain, huh? 00:46:00.320 --> 00:46:04.320 Daniel Cerezo launched his own library of 00:46:04.320 --> 00:46:07.600 wonders. Here in this age it is 1885,886, 00:46:07.600 --> 00:46:10.600 the Third French Republic and. 00:46:10.680 --> 00:46:14.320 Alfonso 00:46:14.440 --> 00:46:17.440 13, the. 00:46:18.400 --> 00:46:21.600 The political friction in both 00:46:21.600 --> 00:46:24.600 places is significant, huh. 00:46:24.600 --> 00:46:25.600 And we have. 00:46:25.600 --> 00:46:29.600 The Spanish king in question is none other than Cecilio 00:46:29.600 --> 00:46:33.600 Navarro. As I said, this Library of Wonders was translated 00:46:33.600 --> 00:46:37.600 many times in France because there were many Spanish 00:46:37.600 --> 00:46:41.600 exiles who did the translations, and then from there it 00:46:41.600 --> 00:46:45.600 was disseminated to other parts of Spain where this 00:46:45.600 --> 00:46:49.600 library was created, as well as to Latin America and 00:46:49.600 --> 00:46:53.600 Italy. So we can say that there is a central source and 00:46:53.600 --> 00:46:57.200 receiving peripheries in different places, 00:46:57.200 --> 00:47:00.200 because, for example, Spain was interested, huh? 00:47:00.520 --> 00:47:04.520 We don't know about this idea from the 10th century, when 00:47:04.520 --> 00:47:10.000 it was solely a French issue, but it is true that there are different ones. 00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:13.600 For example, Ortega did a work, his 00:47:13.600 --> 00:47:16.600 thesis on millenarianism, right? 00:47:18.520 --> 00:47:22.520 Are there other Catalan authors who reflected 00:47:22.520 --> 00:47:26.520 many of Glauber's ideas and those of the year 1000 00:47:26.520 --> 00:47:30.360 in Spanish historiography of the 19th century? 00:47:30.600 --> 00:47:34.600 In other words, well, a topic that isn't necessarily 00:47:34.600 --> 00:47:38.800 Spanish, was already of interest in this 19th century. 00:47:38.880 --> 00:47:42.120 What we have certified as geographical colonization, year one thousand, 00:47:42.120 --> 00:47:43.760 historiographical colonization. 00:47:44.400 --> 00:47:48.400 Well, here is Cecilio Navarro, who is, etc. I think 00:47:48.400 --> 00:47:52.400 it's not very important, and these are the different 00:47:52.400 --> 00:47:56.240 contexts of production, reception, the birth 00:47:56.240 --> 00:47:59.240 of the audience, in short, right? 00:47:59.480 --> 00:48:02.480 A peripheral audience for a central issue, isn't that right? 00:48:03.400 --> 00:48:06.440 These are also issues that we can 00:48:06.440 --> 00:48:09.440 already start looking at, right? 00:48:09.480 --> 00:48:14.480 French as a language of knowledge and Spanish as a language of translation. 00:48:14.480 --> 00:48:19.840 So, historiographical colonization is doing well at this point, huh? 00:48:20.160 --> 00:48:23.280 The third example is the historical novel, right? 00:48:23.800 --> 00:48:27.800 Have I focused on a work that I have studied a 00:48:27.800 --> 00:48:33.560 little, which is, uh, The Page of Don Enrique, the mourner, uh? 00:48:33.560 --> 00:48:37.560 Well, here's the whole issue of Romanticism, the press, 00:48:37.560 --> 00:48:41.560 the novel, liberalism, but also, mmm, in this 19th-century 00:48:41.560 --> 00:48:44.640 historical novel, uh, great authors. 00:48:44.640 --> 00:48:45.320 That's the case. 00:48:53.600 --> 00:48:56.600 Not Larra's? 00:48:56.920 --> 00:49:01.360 And here I want to pause on a point that I think is also important, eh? 00:49:01.360 --> 00:49:05.200 There are many authors of historical novels in the 19th century who are not 00:49:05.200 --> 00:49:07.160 considered. 00:49:07.160 --> 00:49:07.960 This is not the case with Larra. 00:49:07.960 --> 00:49:11.960 He is not the inventor of the new journalism of a different way 00:49:11.960 --> 00:49:15.960 of writing, as we can understand Umbral without understanding, 00:49:15.960 --> 00:49:19.000 without resorting to Larra, for example. 00:49:19.840 --> 00:49:23.840 And all this that has been called the new Spanish journalism, 00:49:23.840 --> 00:49:27.320 column writing, the special relationship of Spanish 00:49:27.320 --> 00:49:30.320 column writing and the press with thought, huh? 00:49:30.320 --> 00:49:32.080 Hmm. 00:49:32.080 --> 00:49:36.080 But I want to make a case for those authors who 00:49:36.080 --> 00:49:40.080 are not Larra and who are not well known and 00:49:40.080 --> 00:49:44.920 who are ultimately authors in search of an audience. 00:49:45.520 --> 00:49:49.520 Many of the novels were published in pieces in the press, etc. 00:49:49.520 --> 00:49:53.520 That is to say, there are many novelists who are neither 00:49:53.520 --> 00:49:57.280 politicians nor important people, but who exist nonetheless. 00:49:58.000 --> 00:50:02.000 And that has also led to a great deal of undervaluing of the 00:50:02.000 --> 00:50:05.680 historical novel from a narrative point of view, and so on. 00:50:05.920 --> 00:50:09.920 Recently, Professor Antonio Huertas sent me 00:50:09.920 --> 00:50:13.920 two novels about the Camino de Santiago, written 00:50:13.920 --> 00:50:17.920 by two authors seeking authorship, seeking 00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:21.920 recognition, seeking an audience with 00:50:21.920 --> 00:50:25.920 self-published works, etc. I think that this 00:50:25.920 --> 00:50:29.920 also has to be included in the study of the themes, 00:50:29.920 --> 00:50:33.920 that is, the denigrated authors, the despised 00:50:33.920 --> 00:50:37.920 authors, the authors who supposedly have a bad 00:50:37.920 --> 00:50:42.920 idea, eh? There is a consensual bad idea about them. 00:50:43.280 --> 00:50:44.800 Okay, this is the case. 00:50:44.800 --> 00:50:45.640 That is not the case. 00:50:45.640 --> 00:50:48.920 Of course, from Larra, where we see they are, right? 00:50:49.040 --> 00:50:53.680 There are central themes in today's historiography. 00:50:53.920 --> 00:50:57.920 For example, the issue of the reconquest, which is central 00:50:57.920 --> 00:51:01.920 to many historians today, was already present in the 19th 00:51:01.920 --> 00:51:05.920 century without any problem, like many other things, and 00:51:05.920 --> 00:51:09.240 you will continue to see this throughout the day. 00:51:10.360 --> 00:51:14.360 Finally, animal trials, animal trials, is 00:51:14.360 --> 00:51:18.120 something that falls somewhere between 00:51:18.120 --> 00:51:21.120 the real and the marvelous, isn't it? 00:51:21.680 --> 00:51:25.680 Where there is also an important issue, which is 00:51:25.680 --> 00:51:30.280 the displacement of the subject of the narrative. Right? 00:51:30.440 --> 00:51:35.880 Uh, no, it's not necessarily humans, but all kinds of animals. 00:51:35.880 --> 00:51:38.920 We have some there, huh? 00:51:39.000 --> 00:51:42.000 There are different ones. 00:51:44.280 --> 00:51:49.520 You mention the 19th century is when this topic really took hold, right? 00:51:49.640 --> 00:51:53.120 With visits, some documentation, etc. 00:51:53.120 --> 00:51:56.120 But it's included too, eh, eh? 00:51:56.520 --> 00:52:00.520 The historiographical consensus tells us that the truth is not being sought, etc. 00:52:00.520 --> 00:52:04.120 The truth is not being sought, emotion is being sought, impact is being sought, the 00:52:04.120 --> 00:52:05.920 audience is being sought. 00:52:05.920 --> 00:52:09.280 It's not a very sensationalist topic. 00:52:10.320 --> 00:52:14.080 Well, one pig hanged, three pigs tortured, one pig burned. 00:52:14.480 --> 00:52:18.480 Well, pigs lived alongside people a lot in the Middle Ages. 00:52:18.480 --> 00:52:20.960 But hey, locust plagues. 00:52:20.960 --> 00:52:23.080 In the end, 00:52:23.080 --> 00:52:28.680 Uh, uh, Evans is perhaps the author. 00:52:28.720 --> 00:52:30.560 Hey, Central. Hey? 00:52:30.560 --> 00:52:32.720 In all of that, a rooster's judgment. 00:52:32.720 --> 00:52:36.720 So, here are some of the authors, 00:52:36.720 --> 00:52:40.720 but as I said, fundamentally this 00:52:40.720 --> 00:52:45.640 book by Evans, is the fundamental one. 00:52:46.240 --> 00:52:48.480 Huh? With 00:52:48.480 --> 00:52:52.480 It has that appendix, uh, documentary where he talks about 00:52:52.480 --> 00:52:56.200 the places he goes to in order to prove these judgments. 00:52:56.200 --> 00:52:59.200 Are there many? 00:52:59.760 --> 00:53:02.760 strange places or documents, etc., right? 00:53:03.440 --> 00:53:06.960 But the truth is, it's a topic that's circulating 00:53:06.960 --> 00:53:09.960 and it's still an image, right? 00:53:10.480 --> 00:53:16.360 Et cetera. Well, we're not going to get into those issues. 00:53:16.360 --> 00:53:17.600 In short. 00:53:17.600 --> 00:53:20.600 To wrap things up, huh? 00:53:21.840 --> 00:53:24.840 The story of the 19th century, huh? 00:53:24.920 --> 00:53:28.920 Can we understand it in another way, and 00:53:28.920 --> 00:53:34.120 not necessarily from the consensus they impose on us? 00:53:34.160 --> 00:53:38.160 Or what have historians constructed, 00:53:38.160 --> 00:53:42.160 at least in this field in which I live, 00:53:42.160 --> 00:53:46.160 in the sense that it is an era mmm, linked 00:53:46.160 --> 00:53:50.080 only to the documentary and to history 00:53:50.080 --> 00:53:53.080 as a science, right? 00:53:53.200 --> 00:53:56.400 Do we have to consider that there's a 00:53:56.400 --> 00:53:59.400 story connected to society, right? 00:53:59.440 --> 00:54:03.440 We must consider that post-truth is transversal to 00:54:03.440 --> 00:54:07.440 the different ways of doing history, whether academic 00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:11.440 or not, post-truth or emotion, opinion, sensationalism, 00:54:11.440 --> 00:54:15.440 etc. And where non-professional historians, 00:54:15.440 --> 00:54:21.080 novelists, whoever wants to, are just as important as professionals. 00:54:21.080 --> 00:54:24.280 And that leads us to break that consensus and also leads 00:54:24.280 --> 00:54:27.280 us to better understand current historiography. 00:54:28.080 --> 00:54:31.360 Current philosophy, as I said before, José Javier Esparza was 00:54:31.360 --> 00:54:34.360 talking the other day about the historians' quarrel. Right? 00:54:35.160 --> 00:54:38.160 He is an intelligent man and knows how to identify problems. 00:54:41.080 --> 00:54:43.560 The audience 00:54:43.560 --> 00:54:47.560 who consumes more historical novels, 00:54:47.560 --> 00:54:52.640 books by Esparza, Roca, Barea or academic books. 00:54:53.240 --> 00:54:56.320 Which side is the audience on? 00:54:56.920 --> 00:54:58.480 Which side is he on? 00:54:58.480 --> 00:55:01.480 The audiences of the media that 00:55:03.280 --> 00:55:06.280 collect the 00:55:06.880 --> 00:55:09.880 discussions and debates of historians. 00:55:10.000 --> 00:55:12.720 Yesterday, for example, the digital journalist, uh, 00:55:12.720 --> 00:55:15.720 A real one. 00:55:17.880 --> 00:55:21.880 Fernando Paz, as disgraceful as he is, was talking about 00:55:21.880 --> 00:55:27.000 war issues with the Falangist Eduardo García Serrano, weren't they? 00:55:27.640 --> 00:55:29.120 Et cetera, right? 00:55:29.120 --> 00:55:32.920 That has an audience, and the audience follows it. 00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:36.720 Eh, eh, 00:55:36.720 --> 00:55:40.720 I say Fernando Paz is unacceptable because they know 00:55:40.720 --> 00:55:44.720 he dabbles in Holocaust denial, etc. And for me, 00:55:44.720 --> 00:55:48.400 that's a red line that makes him unacceptable. 00:55:48.400 --> 00:55:51.400 But it has an audience. 00:55:54.560 --> 00:55:55.720 There are two blocks. 00:55:55.720 --> 00:55:59.720 Today, that consensus does not necessarily exist, or if there 00:55:59.720 --> 00:56:03.080 is a consensus, they want us to explain it from both 00:56:03.080 --> 00:56:06.080 sides, from amateurs and from professionals. 00:56:06.560 --> 00:56:09.560 And we can easily apply that to the 19th century as well. 00:56:17.080 --> 00:56:20.480 Well, thank you very much Israel 00:56:20.480 --> 00:56:23.480 for your, for your lecture. 00:56:23.480 --> 00:56:27.480 I think these are very broad aspects 00:56:27.480 --> 00:56:31.480 that could open up multiple, excuse 00:56:31.480 --> 00:56:35.480 me, multiple debates, and also 00:56:35.480 --> 00:56:38.600 thank you for adhering to 00:56:38.600 --> 00:56:41.600 the proposed time, eh? 00:56:42.000 --> 00:56:46.000 If anyone has any questions, both from the room and 00:56:46.000 --> 00:56:51.080 from the participants who are following us from Teams, okay? 00:56:51.080 --> 00:56:55.080 Would now be the time to move on to Professor 00:56:55.080 --> 00:56:59.080 Martin? Well, uh, I have a question, or 00:56:59.080 --> 00:57:03.080 rather, I reflect, but when you were 00:57:03.080 --> 00:57:07.080 commenting on that audience, uh, we would 00:57:07.080 --> 00:57:11.080 have to study or analyze not only the audience, 00:57:11.080 --> 00:57:15.080 not only the format, because something 00:57:15.080 --> 00:57:19.080 that the novel, the historical novel, 00:57:19.080 --> 00:57:23.080 specifically the contemporary one, has 00:57:23.080 --> 00:57:27.080 is that it tells the story of one of the most, 00:57:27.080 --> 00:57:31.080 the best known and most popular, because 00:57:31.080 --> 00:57:34.080 in Spain they have already had some. 00:57:34.080 --> 00:57:38.080 In some places the novel is very, very conservative 00:57:38.080 --> 00:57:42.440 and often it is a novel about the historian's novel. 00:57:42.720 --> 00:57:46.720 Historians who publish historical novels 00:57:46.720 --> 00:57:50.720 on the one hand, who publish historical 00:57:50.720 --> 00:57:54.720 essays on the other, and who conduct research 00:57:54.720 --> 00:57:58.320 on a historical period on the other. 00:57:58.560 --> 00:58:02.560 On one hand they bring out the novel, on the other 00:58:02.560 --> 00:58:06.320 hand, they bring out the essay and even authors 00:58:06.320 --> 00:58:09.320 in a form of historical distortion. 00:58:09.320 --> 00:58:13.080 I'm thinking, for example, of Eslava Galán, who has a doctorate in medieval 00:58:13.080 --> 00:58:15.000 history. 00:58:15.000 --> 00:58:15.480 I actually think so. 00:58:15.480 --> 00:58:19.480 Yes, if I remember correctly, the thesis regarding 00:58:19.480 --> 00:58:23.480 Poliética and Calvo Poyato, which is also and which 00:58:23.480 --> 00:58:27.360 they publish or have, would be recognizable in 00:58:27.360 --> 00:58:30.360 two lines in their production. 00:58:30.840 --> 00:58:34.840 On the one hand, there's the one published under their own names 00:58:34.840 --> 00:58:38.840 by the author Calvo Poyato, the author Eslava Galán, which 00:58:38.840 --> 00:58:43.880 would be a novel, a historical novel, because it tries to be faithful, right? 00:58:44.200 --> 00:58:48.200 Based on more or less exhaustive documentation, on 00:58:48.200 --> 00:58:52.200 a recognized bibliography, faithful to the facts, 00:58:52.200 --> 00:58:56.200 but then also a handsome Slavic man who is Nicholas 00:58:56.200 --> 00:59:00.120 Wilcox and a bald Poyato who is Peter Harris and who 00:59:00.120 --> 00:59:03.120 publish in search of another audience. 00:59:03.440 --> 00:59:07.440 And in this case, I think it's a majority audience 00:59:07.440 --> 00:59:11.440 and a best-selling novel, a novel about Templars, 00:59:11.440 --> 00:59:15.440 Grails, Cathars, sacred bloodlines, etc., 00:59:15.440 --> 00:59:19.040 etc. I mean, that audience, right? 00:59:19.280 --> 00:59:23.280 Or the search for a mass of readers 00:59:23.280 --> 00:59:27.280 who prefer mysteries surrounding 00:59:27.280 --> 00:59:31.280 history, history itself, means 00:59:31.280 --> 00:59:35.280 that authors with historical 00:59:35.280 --> 00:59:39.280 training often duplicate their 00:59:39.280 --> 00:59:42.880 work in two different genres. Hmm. 00:59:43.640 --> 00:59:47.640 I don't know if it's a question or an observation, but I think it's 00:59:47.640 --> 00:59:51.400 interesting to reflect on what audience is being sought, who is 00:59:51.400 --> 00:59:54.400 seeking it when it's the historian, it's the search. 00:59:54.400 --> 00:59:59.280 If the historian, eh, is when he's a writer, eh? 00:59:59.680 --> 01:00:03.160 Because there are many medievalists, for example, who publish novels, historical 01:00:03.160 --> 01:00:04.920 novels. 01:00:04.920 --> 01:00:07.920 How they act, etc. 01:00:08.880 --> 01:00:12.880 Yes. Um, also, uh, speaking of, for 01:00:12.880 --> 01:00:16.640 example, this in the 19th century, right? 01:00:17.280 --> 01:00:20.040 Uh. Not López Soler. 01:00:20.040 --> 01:00:23.680 That man also has several other aliases. Right? 01:00:24.720 --> 01:00:27.560 Huh? And it has an audience, huh? 01:00:27.560 --> 01:00:31.280 He's looking for an audience too, huh? 01:00:31.280 --> 01:00:36.880 Compared to what you say about contemporary authors, huh? 01:00:36.880 --> 01:00:39.840 That's an important question, isn't it? 01:00:39.840 --> 01:00:45.440 And also being, uh, a, uh, a respect, right? 01:00:45.480 --> 01:00:49.480 For example, all those authors you mentioned... mmm, I... 01:00:49.480 --> 01:00:52.560 I respect them, that's not the right word. 01:00:52.840 --> 01:00:56.600 So, they're people with extensive knowledge, right? 01:00:56.840 --> 01:00:58.800 Just like Esparza, for example. 01:00:58.800 --> 01:01:00.920 This is not the case for De Paz. 01:01:00.920 --> 01:01:04.360 I insist, for a certain reason, right? 01:01:04.720 --> 01:01:08.720 But of course, indeed, they use the same materials 01:01:08.720 --> 01:01:12.840 for different things, but that's why it works so well. 01:01:13.640 --> 01:01:16.720 There's one aspect we never analyzed either, which 01:01:16.720 --> 01:01:19.720 you did, and that's the commercial aspect. Right? 01:01:19.960 --> 01:01:22.280 There's a business issue here. 01:01:22.280 --> 01:01:26.280 Hmm. Many of these texts, etc., 01:01:26.280 --> 01:01:32.120 are considered the ultimate goal in commerce. 01:01:33.280 --> 01:01:36.280 Like, like, of fundamental importance. Right? 01:01:37.080 --> 01:01:42.640 And that also seems important to me, mmm, for analyzing this type of work. 01:01:42.640 --> 01:01:46.640 Of course, it's not the same if you create a work in search of 01:01:46.640 --> 01:01:50.040 an audience, a work that you're going to sell, as if 01:01:50.040 --> 01:01:53.040 you create a monograph, etc. An essay, right? 01:01:53.040 --> 01:01:55.200 Anyway, for example, Eslava Galán should do a rehearsal. 01:01:55.200 --> 01:01:58.400 The novel is a man of great 01:01:58.400 --> 01:02:01.400 dimension, isn't it? 01:02:01.400 --> 01:02:04.400 Eh of audience. 01:02:07.440 --> 01:02:11.240 This will become something that... 01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:16.320 Is it becoming more common? 01:02:17.480 --> 01:02:19.760 We don't know. 01:02:19.760 --> 01:02:23.200 It is necessary that there be a disclosure that. 01:02:23.200 --> 01:02:26.480 That there be a connection between 01:02:26.480 --> 01:02:29.480 academics and society. 01:02:29.480 --> 01:02:33.360 Huh? And that connection is possible without the intermediation 01:02:33.360 --> 01:02:36.360 of capitalism, without selling, without trade. 01:02:37.160 --> 01:02:37.920 That's important. 01:02:37.920 --> 01:02:39.840 But we also find it in the 19th century. 01:02:39.840 --> 01:02:42.960 Isn't everything about all these works, everything 01:02:42.960 --> 01:02:45.960 we're talking about, huh? How can we not understand it? 01:02:45.960 --> 01:02:51.720 This collection we've been talking about is the Library of Wonders, right? 01:02:51.720 --> 01:02:56.520 The sales figures are incredibly significant, aren't they? 01:02:57.520 --> 01:03:02.400 Uh, with a very reasonable price. Right? 01:03:02.400 --> 01:03:04.000 They were drawing things, huh? 01:03:04.000 --> 01:03:04.880 They were of interest. 01:03:04.880 --> 01:03:05.720 What does that mean? 01:03:05.720 --> 01:03:07.840 That there is an audience, that there is a. 01:03:07.840 --> 01:03:11.840 There is interest, uh, someone 01:03:11.840 --> 01:03:15.160 who wants, uh, to read this. 01:03:16.280 --> 01:03:19.400 Another question is why, for example, in the 19th century. 01:03:21.560 --> 01:03:24.920 Are we interested in translating a text like this one, or others from that 01:03:24.920 --> 01:03:26.640 Library of Wonders? 01:03:27.240 --> 01:03:29.840 How are we building audiences? 01:03:29.840 --> 01:03:33.120 Why are there these interests? 01:03:33.560 --> 01:03:37.560 There is another audience that is created in the historical novel, 01:03:37.560 --> 01:03:42.360 which is, therefore, from the press, from enlightened people and elites. 01:03:43.000 --> 01:03:46.280 I don't know, it's also a reflection, but I think that, ultimately, where is all 01:03:46.280 --> 01:03:47.960 this leading us? 01:03:48.440 --> 01:03:51.040 The need to include the audience 01:03:51.040 --> 01:03:54.040 as part. 01:03:54.040 --> 01:03:57.040 Not from the investigation? 01:03:57.840 --> 01:04:01.120 Ah, precisely Professor Carlos Mata, who 01:04:01.120 --> 01:04:04.120 congratulates you on the presentation. 01:04:04.120 --> 01:04:04.640 I was. 01:04:04.640 --> 01:04:08.960 I was just mentioning it before you said it. 01:04:08.960 --> 01:04:09.960 I didn't say that. 01:04:09.960 --> 01:04:13.960 In the case of the success of current historical 01:04:13.960 --> 01:04:17.960 novels, good, bad or worse, the marketing factor is 01:04:17.960 --> 01:04:21.960 fundamental, the publishing promotion, marketing 01:04:21.960 --> 01:04:25.960 are, uh, weighty elements that are there when it comes 01:04:25.960 --> 01:04:30.280 to approaching, disseminating and also generating. 01:04:30.280 --> 01:04:34.280 And it's curious because they generate, uh mmm 01:04:34.280 --> 01:04:38.280 for the other side of the debate they don't 01:04:38.280 --> 01:04:42.280 generate states of opinion regarding myths, 01:04:42.280 --> 01:04:46.520 legends, and nationalisms also in many, in many cases. 01:04:46.880 --> 01:04:50.880 But with your permission, we'll leave 01:04:50.880 --> 01:04:54.880 it here, because we have our little 01:04:54.880 --> 01:04:58.880 raisin now, otherwise we won't be 01:04:58.880 --> 01:05:02.880 delayed and we'll continue in 15, 15, 01:05:02.880 --> 01:05:08.760 20 minutes with communications table number one. 01:05:08.760 --> 01:05:12.760 Many thanks to everyone who is following us both via 01:05:12.760 --> 01:05:17.920 streaming and to the other speakers who are online and will be in 15 minutes. 01:05:17.920 --> 01:05:20.000 We'll see you all again. Thank you so much.